Rusted Powersteering Pump Replacement 99 Caravan

I'm trying to get self prepared for a Power steering pump replacement
on a 1999 Dodge Grand Caravan V6 3.0L. I'm reading that it is a
P.I.T.A. job (Pain In The A$$). I'm armed with the Hayes repair
manual, a little common sense, basic tools, and an instruction guide
from this link:
http://www.cardone.com/English/Club/Products/Steering/Protech/Install_Instructions/93062720.asp

I've also been scanning the newsgroups and I'm surprised that there
aren't more posts on this considering the hole rusted through in 6
only years of use. I guess it was no match for the WI salt. I found a
post that hits it dead on, but it lacks information and the poster
doesn't go into detail about installing. He mainly says how hard the
pump was to get off. See it at this link:
http://groups.google.com/group/alt....t&q=caravan power steering pump&rnum=1&hl=en&

(History: I discovered the leak for about 4 weeks ago. It leaves
about a 12" spot of fluid every 10 hour sitting. Out of desperation,
I tried one of those stop leak juices. In fact 3 full bottles. I've
never used any type of "stop leak" remedy before because I feel
they just don't work. Well... as expected, it didn't. Last night
I finally took a peek under the van and saw the bottom of the pump
casing is bubbly with rust. I can actually watch droplets of power
steering fluid form where the rust is the weakest. I took pictures of
the pump and would be willing to post them upon request.)

I can't see paying $575 ($212 + $350 Labor + tax) for a job that I
can maybe do my own. It will cost me $100 for the part on the internet
and I'm guessing a full Saturday of sweat and aggravation. I just
called the shop and the price of $350 for labor doesn't include
replacing of the hoses. The tech said, "We don't replace the hoses
unless there's something wrong with them. They can last the life of
the car."

Questions: Can anyone please, please provide any tips that will help?
How long (average) should it take to do a job like this (or how long
did it take you to do it)? Any special tools for the pully? What
could reasonably be removed to make the job easier? Is it really worth
replacing the hoses? Any replies would be appreciated.

Thanks
~Tim

 

I am surprised too - I've never had a PS pump rust through.

Regular underbody and engine compartment cleaning can reduce salt
corrosion on any car.

They are designed to make leaking seals work a bit longer not plug
holes. Barr's Leak works sometimes on radiators but I wouldn't
recommend it for power steering pumps.

Don't know of a source for averages. The more experienced you are with
tools such as wrenches and sockets and knowlegeable about automotive
repair the less time it will take.

You are going to have to look at the job and figure that out. Varies
from car to car. The Haynes book should be of help - follow the
directions.

Ordinarily I would not replace them. Since the pump resided an
environment corrosive enough to rust through the pump body, I would
expect some weakening of those hoses too. I would give some thought to
replacement.


Any replies would be appreciated.

 

My rule of thumb is that if I think I can do the job in one day, I allow
two days to complete the job.

 

Mitchell ltg says 1.6 hrs, check autozone.com/repairinfo, may have better
instructions.

 

Here's my recommendation.

Drain all power steering fluid from the pump

Clean off the bottom of the pump as best you can with laquer thinner or
some other solvent that doesen't leave a residue.

Fashion a metal plate out of an old tin can.

Obtain some long wire ties from the hardware store (these are sold for
holding flexible ventilation tubing to vents.)

Liberally apply JB Weld to the bottom of the pump. Press the plate
to the JB Weld. Use the ties to secure the plate.

Once it hardens, refill the pump and FLUSH THE SYSTEM with clean
PS fluid. (ie: put the return line in a bucket and run the car while
pouring new
fluid in the system and having an assistant turn the wheels right and left)

You have a very good chance that this repair will hold, and if it does then
you probably won't need to go through the hassle of R&R the pump.

Also it's likely the pump rotted from inside out, you probably got water in
the PS fluid, and it's only a matter of time before the entire rack itself
rots and starts leaking.

Ted

 

Ted...what are you on?? What in the heck are you talking about??

 

Hopefully not too much of this rust mixed with the fluid. The rack seals are
quite sensitive to contamination.

Are the hoses protected with rubber or are they bare metal in certain areas?
If you can visually examine any metal parts of the hoses and they appear fine,
it might be worth putting off this repair. If they are questionable, you will
probably be doing the procedure again in the future.

Usually you need a puller for the pulley. Those can be rented at Autozone.
Rack rebuilders I have talked to recommend against Atsco/ARI or Cardone
rebuilds, so try to find a higher quality brand. (FWIW, I have an ARI in my
car that seems fine so far.) If there is a high pressure cut-off switch in
your pump, remember to transplant it into the rebuild because it probably won't
come with one.

When you are done, thoroughly flush out the steering system with clean PS
fluid. Put the return line into a bucket and keep the reservoir filled while a
friend turns the rack from one stop to the other, until the fluid runs clear at
the return. Refill it with the manufacturer's recommended PS fluid. Using the
wrong PS fluid can damage the rack seals. Unfortunately, since you have
already used a stop leak product, you may have to continue to use this product
to prevent the rack from leaking. I would solicit advice from others who have
used the particular product that you used.

 

On the '96 model, removing the pump is easy....getting it out of the
vehicle is not. I'd expect the 99 to be similar. In a nutshell, the
pump has to come out the tunnel where the exhaust pipe runs to the
manifold....so the exhaust has to be taken loose and dropped out of the
way. Remember to disconnet the harness to the O2 sensor first. I've
never had any luck removing and reusing the pulley, even with the
proper tool. Go to the dealer and buy a new pulley....they're about 25
bucks. Most rebuilt pumps will come with an installation tool.

Changing the hoses without removing the rack is next to impossible, so
don't unless you have to.

Like many of these jobs, the first one is a PITA, the next one goes
much faster.

 

it will be easier to do the job with the wiper cowl and wiper motor tray removed and a new pump from the dealer does not come with a pulley but it does come with a
coating on the tank so it won't rust in 5 years such as the first one did. make dam sure the pulley/ shaft are in the exact same spot in relation to the pulley on
the shaft or the belt will fling off and make sure the wiper tray drain is put bac on.
the aftermarket one does not come with a pulley either, at least the ones i have gotten. and make sure the belt tensoner jumps back or it's bad since you are in
there.
with a tray under the lines and the wheels off the ground move the tires left to right a few times to push out old fluid and replace with new and do the same so it
flushes out the rack and pinion

 

OK, I know the name JB Weld is like drawing nails across a blackboard
with some people but here's my reasoning.

Reread the original post. Here's the operative sentence:

"Last night I finally took a peek under the van and saw the bottom of the
pump
casing is bubbly with rust. I can actually watch droplets of power
steering fluid form where the rust is the weakest."

Look at it. He's got a PS pump with a perforated resivor. That means
for some time now his PS fluid has probably been contaminated with rust.
He also dumped 3 bottles of stop leak into the PS fluid. So his rack right
now is
filled with ps fluid, rust, and stop leak crap.

Plus that he's got so much salt water coming up from below as to saturate
the bottom of the vehicle to the point that it's rotted out the bottom of
the PS pump. Can you imagine for a second what the bottom of the
rest of the van looks like? What the rack itself looks like?

To really do this job right would mean tearing out the pump and the
rack and all hoses and just throwing everything in the trash and
and replacing everything with new stuff.

It is NOT in my opinion very smart to hook up a brand new PS
pump to a rack that's full of crappy ps fluid that may or may
not be contaminated with salt water, almost certainly has a good
load of rust in it, plus 3 bottles of stop leak crap, and pump all that
crud into the new pump.

Far better to band-aid the existing pump for a few years and
eventually it's either going to finish rotting out completely, or he's
going to end up with an inner tie rod that's hashed and will
need a new rack anyway, then he can just replace everything
then.

If you see a flaw with this reasoning then please explain it. Maybe
I'm too pessimistic but I just can't believe with a PS pump that has
the bottom rusted out of it, that the inside of his rack is pristine.

He can probably do a Rube Goldberg thing on the PS pump
with JB Weld in an hour, without taking anything apart. That will
nurse the pump along to allow him to wring the last few miles out
of the rack itself, then when the rack blows chunks, he can do
everything all at once.

Ted

 

A little mickey mouse but it make's sense. The op was wondering about
putting new hoses on it. Certainly will save him some money Sounds like the
van is on the way out.

Roy

 

Good one Ted.. ... I am certainly with you.. if it holds for the 1st day I
also would expect it to outlast the rest of the system at this point !!! If
he wants to take it to the dealer and have the car rebuilt around it....
bully for him.. Agree the only way to "fix" it is yank it all and pitch
it.. maybe find a U-pull with low miles and good shape..

Hell if the guy wanted to spend $2500 on the car he wouldn't have been here
in the first place !!

My $.02 with yours

 

Ted, My opinion. The power steering pump sits over the top of the right
axle. which means salt water and what ever else is hitting the bottom of
the resorvoir causing the rust and the leak. Me personnally, I can't see
that kind of water getting into the pump without causing the fluid to be
milky.
And if your gonna go thru that much trouble to try to seal a leak, you may
as well take the pump off and replace it with a reman one.
If the OP takes it off and carries it to Pep boys or Auto zone, Im sure
they will press the pulley on and off. They should have the shim that is
used to get the correct gap for pulley alignment.

Just a thought!

Glenn Beasley
Chrysler Tech

Didnt know this was a double post in the dodge group so i will cut and paste
what I said in there

 

Ted, My opinion. The power steering pump sits over the top of the right
axle. which means salt water and what ever else is hitting the bottom of
the resorvoir causing the rust and the leak. Me personnally, I can't see
that kind of water getting into the pump without causing the fluid to be
milky.
And if your gonna go thru that much trouble to try to seal a leak, you may
as well take the pump off and replace it with a reman one.
If the OP takes it off and carries it to Pep boys or Auto zone, Im sure
they will press the pulley on and off. They should have the shim that is
used to get the correct gap for pulley alignment.

Just a thought!

Glenn Beasley
Chrysler Tech
Didnt know this was a double post in the dodge group so I will cut and paste

 

My guess also is that the OP should start frequenting car washes that wash
the undercarriage on a regular basis. Or do it himself. It's a nasty job
but
necessary in some climates.

Ted