Problem With Power Outlet

The only other person here who has in the past demonstrated significant
knowledge of things electrical is Bill, and I haven't seen Bill claim
2.2V per cell.

Matt

 

Load testers have their place to be sure, but on the rare occasions I
need one, I take my battery to a garage and have it tested. It is rare
that this test is needed so I haven't bothered to invest in one myself.
Modern batteries are just too reliable to need this sort of tester for
routine testing.


Matt

 

Wow - so we have a perpetual motion machine in our alternators, eh? So
that regulator will force the alternator to put out 14 volts even with
the alternator rpm 0? No you say? OK - what about 2 rpm? What about
100 rpm. This is silly. There is a certain minimum rpm at which
regulation falls off, and most vehicles will have tapered off at idle
with some load on it, some with minimal load.

To reiterate: Your claim that analternator will put out full regulated
voltage at all rpm's (including 0) is ridiculous and flat out false.
And just because some vehicle will regulate fully at idle with minimum
load doesn;t mean they all will - most won't.

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')

 

Max Dodge wrote:

OK - so we're back to voltage drop in the wires *PLUS* the normal good
battery voltage being lower than the running voltage. So it all adds up
to the inverter is not getting the voltage it needs to run which will be
confirmed once the measurements are taken at the socket.

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')

 

Max Dodge wrote:

Everyone was confused by your statement yesterday morning posted at
10:27: "Have a load test done elsewhere, or simply replace the battery"
followed by your subsequent claim that you never said to replace the
battery without testing any further. So by making statements all over
the map and then cherry picking what you want out of all you said and
denying the rest, you can claim that you never said "simply replace the
battery".

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')

 

Actually, what they are saying is that they don't have an adapter to get to
the power connections with the inverter plugged in.

 

Reaching into the socket as you suggest would be pointless as with no load
their will ALWAYS be battery voltage if the socket is powered. The drop
comes from current draw which will only happen if the load is connected and
then there is no reaching into the socket. You could tag the connectors to
the socket but that is probably more of a PITA then they are willing to do
for free.

 

If you get a meter with needle probes, you could use them to pierce the
insulation on the wires to your inverter and read the voltage there as it
will be the same voltage as at the plug. There is nothing different about
the meter itself, only how they connect.

 

Which also means that the red lead connects to the center pin and the black
one goes to the case or side of the connector.

 

No, it is not that simple. He needs to make BOTH contacts in the socket.
The problem could be a corroded ground connection in the socket and your
test would eliminate that and possibly give false results.

--
If at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving

http://www.SecureIX.com ***

 

Neither does anyone else.

 

Get used to this dude, <ax is the master of spin and NEVER admits to error
of any kind.

--
If at first you don't succeed, you're not cut out for skydiving

 

Yea, after you suggested just replacing the damn battery.

 

Is it costing him anything to ask in the group. Actually, it is
helping;ping him to learn some basic troubleshooting which is FAR more than
he would have gotten just replacing the battery, especially when it is
obvious that the battery is not the problem.

 

Is that how you fix transmissions Gary?

 

Too bad you seem to be in the first half .

 

Was done multipe times and shown to be ok.

Also done and shows a significant voltage drop.

Means absolutly nothing to someone without experience.

Then why do you keep telling him to take it to a shop.

 

Great crap, ALL this thread about a stinking auxiliary power outlet?

SHEESH!

1) measure the voltage at the outlet with the load applied. If its too
low, meassure at the battery.

2) if its too low at both the battery and the outlet, replace the battery.

3) if its just too low at the outlet, run a heavier gauge wire from the
power distribution center to the power outlet.

4) Stop whining.



Or better yet, skip 1-4 above and:

a) Get a power adaptor for your laptop that doesn't need a cheeseball
120 V inverter in the first place: http://us.kensington.com/html/1422.html

b) Stop whining.

 

I did some more testing this morning, after the car's been sitting all
night. This time I tested the battery at each step, to see if there's a
battery drop. I only tested the power outlets with the engine off. Here are
the steps I took, and the results.

Front Power Outlet
--------------------------
Battery: 12.8
Power outlet: 12.7
Plugged in inverter alone
Battery: 12.7
Inverter: 12.6
Plugged charger alone into inverter
Battery: 12.6
Inverter: 12.4
Plugged laptop into charger (off, but charging)
Battery: 12.4
Inverter: 11.7
Plugged laptop into charger (on and charging)
Battery: 12.4
Inverter: 11.3 (Inverter turned off after about 10 seconds. Unplugged
inverter, plugged it back in, got reading, then inverter turned off again.)

Rear Power Outlet
--------------------------
Unplugged everything from front power outlet.
Battery: 12.7
Power outlet: 12.7
Plugged in inverter alone
Battery: 12.7
Inverter: 12.6
Plugged charger alone into inverter
Battery: 12.7
Inverter: 12.5
Plugged laptop into charger (off, but charging)
Battery: 12.6
Inverter: 11.6
Plugged laptop into charger (on and charging)
(Inverter turned off too quickly to get a reading at the battery. However, I
placed the probes into the inverter auxiliary outlet and watched the voltage
as someone else plugged in the laptop. Before the laptop was plugged in,
inverter was at 12.5V, which is the same as above. When laptop was plugged
in, inverter dropped to 11.6, stayed there for about a second, and then
inverter turned off. One would think that the inverter turned off at 11.6V.
However, given that in the tests done yesterday and today there was a
0.4-0.8V difference in the inverter between the laptop being on and the
laptop being off; and since it was at 11.6V when it was off; it must have
dropped below 11.6V and turned off before it could register on the VM.)

Given the above two sets of numbers, it seems that the inverter is turning
off at around 11V. That seems like kind of a high threshold to me. However,
note again that I used this same inverter/laptop combination with my Jimmy
for a long time, and didn't have a problem once. So perhaps the 11V
threshold is correct and the voltage at the inverter should be above 11V
with the laptop plugged in and on.

I'll repost the results from yesterday below, so as to have them all in one
message (apologies for posting them twice).

Thanks,

Neil

======== YESTERDAY'S RESULTS ========

Battery
-----------------
Engine off: 13.0
Engine on: 13.5

Front Power Outlet (Engine Off)
----------------------------------
Outlet alone: 13.0
With inverter alone: 12.9
With charger alone in inverter: 12.8
With laptop plugged in (off and charging): 12.0
With laptop plugged in (on and charging): 11.2

(These were with all doors closed and all interior lights and other
accessories off. However, when first testing, the side door was open. There
were no interior lights on (turned them off with the switch). However, a
small light in the dash telling me the door was open was on. In this
scenario, when I plugged the laptop in with it on and charging, the inverter
turned itself off. When the door was then closed, I got the above reading,
11.2V.)

Front Power Outlet (Engine On)
----------------------------------
Outlet alone: 13.5
With inverter alone: 13.4
With charger alone in inverter: 13.4
With laptop plugged in (off and charging): 12.4
With laptop plugged in (on and charging): 12.0

(In this setup, the doors were closed. However, I tested it with the door
open, as per above when the inverter turned off. In that case, I got 12.2V
for the last one, instead of 12.0. That doesn't really make sense that the
voltage would be higher. So maybe there was some fluctuation.)

Rear Power Outlet (Engine On)
----------------------------------
Outlet alone: 13.5
With inverter alone: 13.4
With charger alone in inverter: 13.3
With laptop plugged in (off and charging): 12.0
With laptop plugged in (on and charging): Inverter turned off

Rear Power Outlet (Engine Off)
----------------------------------
Outlet alone: 13.2
With inverter alone: 13.1
With charger alone in inverter: 13.0
With laptop plugged in (off and charging): Inverter turned off
With laptop plugged in (on and charging): Inverter turned off

(Note that the engine had been on for the two previous tests, which might
explain why the outlet had 13.2V, while the battery with the engine off had
previously tested at 13.0V. This is all the more interesting, though, since
the inverter turned itself off with the laptop off and plugged in.
Previously, the inverter remained on in the rear outlet when the laptop was
off and plugged in. Yet here the outlet is showing a higher voltage of 13.2V
with nothing in it, yet the inverter didn't stay on with the laptop off and
plugged in. Tested that twice.)

===================================================

 

Virtually all "multimeters" or packaged voltmeters will read both. Not
likely to buy a bare panel meter to do this job.