Oldsmobile joins Plymouth: RIP

No, people are driving trucks all the time now because the average person's
lifestyle has changed. Families are smaller than they used to be, and
nowadays a lot of parents are just buying their kids cheap $1000 used
cars instead of letting them drive their car. After all the last thing
you need is to come out in the morning to go to work and find your
transportation smashed up. So, families are buying more vehicles.

A lot of what I see these days is families that have a truck that is
used as a commuter/work vehicle by the one spouse, a sedan that is used
as a commuter vehicle by the other spouse, and a minivan or suv that
is used to haul the family around on the weekend.

This is a far cry from 30 years ago when it was a station wagon and
a sedan, or from 60 years ago when it was just 1 sedan and the wife
either had everything delivered, or the husband took the train to work,
and when you needed a truck you hired the guy that drove it.

Ted

 

You're correct, except the kids' beaters are probably more in the $2-5k
range. Of course there are exceptions, but a typical $1000 car these
days will not be very reliable (more trouble than they are worth) for
any length of time - if it was, it would have sold for more.

Bill Putney
(to reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with "x")

 

<snip gramatically-challenged nonsensical response>

I'll take that as a "yes."

 

I'll take that you're a first-class Ass Wipe..... do you understand that or
do you need someone to spell it out for you?
SRG

 

One word: TIRES.

The *best* tires of the '60s could not manage the traction of those on
the average econobox of the '90s. Mark Donohue's Trans Am
championship Camaro couldn't corner or stop any better than a 1995
Toyota Corolla. The same thing goes for acceleration. At 0.75g *or
less* all of the '60s mucslecars were smoking their tires. These
days, that's merely adequate.

 

Yep, people in North America drive trucks and SUV's because fuel is
artificially cheap. Highway travel in the US is subsidized by taxes other
than fuel and license taxes. Americans think they need large, inefficient
vehicles to cover large distances which is, of course, complete bulls@#$. A
50mpg VW Jetta diesel will carry two adults and two kids comfortably. A
28mpg Intrepid will carry four or five adults comfortably. A minivan will
carry six or seven people more comfortably than an SUV while getting better
gas mileage. America simply has a "culture of waste" which is demonstrated
by the mix of vehicles we drive. The CAFE system is, of course, seriously
flawed in that it was conceived when trucks were trucks, but has not
adjusted to account for the fact that most "trucks" are now being used as
passenger cars. The auto industry has spent tens of millions of dollars
lobbying legislators to not "fix" the flawed law.

 

Wow. Someone has serious Ford issues.

I own two 5.0's, and don't have a problem with any one who wants to tell me
that they're actually 4.9's. But you... Your whole post is "sore point."

I guess that every carmaker who has ever issued a recall, then, would be a
"liar".

dwight

 

I cannot agree. It is simply not artificially expensive, as long as
you don't count the fifty cents or so of gas taxes per gallon.

This is certainly better than the English situation where massive
taxation on vehicles is simply slurped into the general fund.
Furthermore, the country depends on highway travel, as does the
national defense.

I would say instead that we have a culture where people are free
to drive what they want, so long as they can afford it. The Jetta
TDI is a fine car but you will regret towing a cabin cruiser with
it.

Mandating that people drive what they "need" is a disturbing slippery
slope that ends up with a nation of Trabants. You don't think I need
an SUV? There's someone out there who thinks your Intrepid is too big
and poses a danger to spotted owls. The guy with a Jetta TDI is
considered a space-waster by the guy who has a Golf TDI. The Polo TDI
driver thinks they are both a danger to society; the guy in the Lupo
TDI thinks the Polo guy is a closet aristocrat, and so on.

It's only flawed in the sense that it is government sticking its nose
where it doesn't belong. When you spend your day being chauffered
around DC in a limo, it's hard to understand what families in Wyoming
need or want, and harder to care.

 

I remember those ads.

"Our cars don't jump out of Park all by themselves",

This one, too. There was an '83 Bird parked provocatively
on a hillside in San Francisco, while a chorus of sassy
Supremes clones sang the hook.

Oh yes, the famous two-part ad during the SuperBowl. Imagine my
surprise when Sam Waterston got out of that Mark VIII, looked
the camera in the eye, and delivered that line! I trusted Ford
all over again!

What amazed me about this one was the music licensing. "Never My
Love!"

You ask me if this car of mine
Could catch on fire for you
Pintos are safe,
Pintos are safe.

How can we make cars that last
When our own lying ass-
es won't drive...
them?

I think this ad campaign was confined to print, for obvious reasons,
but Freddy The Fan was a great cartoon character. Remember when he
was going to fly apart about something... and in the last panel he
said, "WAIT! I'M A MOTORCRAFT GENUINE FAN, AND I WON'T FLY APART!"

Not ringing a bell.

But here's an ad you might want to consider - "Get back in the game
with Levitra." It's easier to let go of irrational anti-Ford sentiment
when you can obtain, and maintain, an erection.

 

Exactly. Also affecting the large proportion of land yachts is the
'conspicuous consumption' and 'macho' syndrom. 'Hey look at me, I'm
driving a ... I must be important' You only have to read some of the
SUV bashing threads before you come to the justification for having
one 'Because I can afford it and you're just jealous'. As for comfort
on long drives, god save me from having to use a truck or SUV, I'll
take a mid-size car any day over any of them.

Harry K

 

I remember those ads.

LOL, tell that to my mom's 78 Bronco. While we never had a problem with it, it
did indeed drop out of the P to R position on a couple occasions while I
watched it.

In all other respects that truck was bulletproof, ran 235,000 miles before we
sold it and the guy we sold it to still uses it every winter to plow his garage
lots...


Wir welle bleiwe wat mir sin
(Letzebuergesch)

 

I had a '68 Ranchero (after my Dad drove it a nearly 10 years before I
got it) that dropped out of Park also. How did we survive without death
and dismemberment? Simple: Use the friggin PARKING BRAKE!! Over 200k
miles on that car (uh truck... whatever) when I sold it, and it never
injured anyone. Talk about things getting blown out of proportion.

One funny memory I have of it is that you had to adopt the "Standard
Ford Starting Position (tm)" every time you fired it up because of the
sloppy gear detents:

- Get in car.
- Lean forward
- With left hand, reach behind the steering wheel, over the top of the
steering column, and grasp gear selector lever with left hand and pull
UP firmly
- Reach down and insert ignition key with right hand
- Start car
- Release gearshift and lean back
- Repeat when car stalls

You think I'm kidding? Next time you're watching "TV Land" or "Nick at
Nite" watch the actors anytime they start a 60s-70s Ford. I remember a
period of time when people accustomed to driving Fords would start ALL
cars that way. In fact it took me a while to break myself of the habit
when I started driving my 73 Satellite in 1981.

 

It takes a True Believer to claim that fuel is "artificially cheap" when
a full HALF of the price per gallon is TAX.

Sheesh.

 

Yes: Ford.

 

No, people in Europe drive teeny weeny cars because fuel is
artificially expensive.

Non-car travel in the US is subsidized by fuel and license taxes.

Obviously false. A diesel carries no one comfortably.

 

It is artificially expensive in Europe where the tax on fuel is four times
what it is in the US. It is, however, artificially cheap in the US.
General tax revenue, in addtion to fuel tax pays for the infrastructure for
road traffic.

Not really. General tax revenue, in addtion to fuel tax pays for the
infrastructure for road traffic.

You obviously have not driven, or even ridden in a recent diesel car.

 

As it SHOULD be, since the vast majority taxable goods travel to the
point-of-sale by (wait for it....) the highway infrastructure.

When all taxable goods can magically arrive at their destinations solely
by air and rail, THEN we can talk about gas being "artificially" cheap.
Until then, its a completely bogus claim.

 

To say nothing of the original customer for the Interstate system,
namely our military-industrial complex.

I drove a section of US 40 a while ago through PA... I can't believe
trucks ever used that to take goods cross-country. The late model
Explorer in front of me was struggling to get up the hills.

 

A diesel carries no one comfortably.

http://www.mbusa.com/brand/models/E320CDI.jsp

 

Its the people BEHIND that stinkpot that are miserable.... ;-)


Yes, I know diesels are getting cleaner every day. But even the cleanest
still SMELL like diesel.