Key fob costs over a hundred dollars

Those chip controlled ignition switches in the new car will set you back a
bundle if you lose the remote key fob. At least $100 because its about $60
for the charm and $40 for the electronic programming.

God forbid if the electronic controlled switch itself goes bad when you try
to start the engine to drive out of Death Valley after a picnic in the
desert. You will need divine intervention because there is no way on Earth
you will get that car going, no matter how many PhDs you have in automotive
technology (the term, auto mechanics has gone out of fashion).

Here's my thesis: I believe a car can be built using simple conventional
systems (mechanical fuel injection, electro-mechanical ignition,
non-electronic transmission), totally devoid of active computers and still
pass smog laws and OBD II. This car would be user and mechanic friendly.
Modular electronics, such as a discrete a-c generator control and selective
Kettering-CD ignition would make diagnosis and repair literally child's
play. The only computer would be the law mandated OBD II but it would be
in diagnostic mode only, not necessary for drive train functions.

And I don't need memory seats, electronic windows & door locks, automatic
headlamps, etc. ad infinitum, either. Just a car that gets me from point A
to point B.

There is ample reason to build such a car. In the news this week, we
learned 1000 U.S. made trucks have been given to the new Iraqi government's
police forces. It was stated Iraqi auto mechanics are incapable of
maintaining these highly computerized trucks. Not only is our tax money
wasted, but the export market is nill because the word has got around, you
buy a $30,000 American truck, you can't fix it and its soon on the junk
pile keeping company with Yugos.

There is every reason to believe a conventional car would last longer and
be cheaper in the long run than 2007 models that have more computers in
them than the Saturn Moon Rocket. A conventional machine, easy to fix would
also sell broadly in the export market, but we don't make any such animal.
Shame on us.

For those of you who prefer, a complex, impossible to fix car, just go buy
a Mercedes Benz and leave the rest of us out of the nightmare modern cars
have become.

 

There is no way you can achieve modern emissions compliance in the US
without real-time closed loop control of mixture. You really don't know
what you are talking about.

India's Tata Motors probably makes something more suitable.

 

<snip>

Nomen, are you posting from a new account? I wish you'd stick to just
one, so you'd stay killfiled.

 

I agree that for a war-torn country like Iraq, or under-developed areas
anywhere, a vehicle with a carburetor, point-and-coil ignition, etc. would
make sense For the developed world, most of the technology in today's cars
makes sense.

I too, can do without memory seats, keyless engine starting, and other of
these recent gadgets that are showing up in more and more new cars, but
today's engine controls are great. The engines start well, are clean, make
good power, and get good fuel economy. If all of today's cars were replaced
with 50's cars, you wouldn't be able to breath in the cities.

 

Based on the recent Consumer Reports Annual Report edition few will be
buying a troublesome Mercedes if they have any brains.

 

Agreed on all points in the replies!

 

Oh I don't know about that. While camping last summer, a young couple
next to us had a 1948 Chevrolet. This had a 230 CID striaght six in
it. Total plain-jane. Now I cannot speak for its actual emission
values, but I can tell you the exhause did not "stink" like most of
the cars in the 70's and 80's did!

Oh, and that 1948 Chev got about 20 MPG city, and 27 MPG highway.

I run a 2002 Dodge Grand Caravan with the 3.3 V6. I get about 18 MPG
city, and 27 on the highway with a good tail-wind.

Somewhere, somehow, MPG and emmissions have to be connected. And it
makes me SICK that it appears despite many so-called "improvements" in
design, we really are not much farther ahead than in 1948. Yes, todays
vehicles are more SAFE, but they get no better mileage as such. It
looks to me as though a lot of the mileage has been gained by making
smaller engines! Lots of cars have 1500 CC engines now compared with
5.7 litre engines (5700 CC) (350/351 CID) of the past.

The only thing that has changed is that the oil companies are making
one hell of a lot more profit at our expense these days than they did
in 1948.

 

Most people don't purchase a MB for reliability but rather for status.

Ken

--
"Now Phoebe Snow direct can go
from thirty-third to Buffalo.
From Broadway bright the tubes run right
Into the Road of Anthracite"
Erie - Lackawanna

 

Not sticking up for the earl companies, but actually the price of gas
has gone down over the years as the percentage of income.

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')

 

For once I agree with you. Someone on a forum on which I was reading up
on the topic of the outragious cost and complexity of smart keys stated
that a replacement key for a Lexus cost $340 - and programing of that
key was additional cost!

I replaced a key in my wife's '99 Buick - had a "chip" in it. A little
internet research showed that the "chip" was a resistor. Found the
value of the resistor, hard wired that value resistor (from Radio Shack)
across the two wires of the "special chip reader" circuit in the vehicle
wiring, and had Walmart cut a standard (non-"chip") resistor key of the
same otherwsie design, and it worked like a champ. I had several copies
of the key made for spares ($0.75 each). Dealer wanted over $35 for the
"high tech" key.

Funny how someone can get arrested and prosecuted for price gouging in
areas with natural disasters if they charge too much for certain
commodities, yet this kind of crap is allowed to go on without penalty.

BTW - I'm told that the systems on GM's (and others) have been made
"more sophisticated" (i.e., not a simple resistor) since '99, and if you
lose a key or problems develop, you are SOL without spending a *lot* of
money. We have way surpassed the point of diminishing returns on some
of this technology crap (and I say that as an engineer and circuit
designer).

Bill Putney
(To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my
address with the letter 'x')

 

I fully agree, Bill. I hate the excessive complication of the electronics
nowadays.

 

An old engine with fragile crank bearing lubrication.
All the old ones stink, I can tell if one is ahead of me.

Anyone I knew got 21-23 imperial MPG on the highway. Several in my
family had that fragile engine in Chevs.
Has fuel improved since then?

That's about right. After all it's a heavy vehicle with lots of wind
resistance.

My LH 3.3L smokes (bad term here!) similar sized cars of the past
(50s/60s) for MPG.
About 50% more MPG.

It is even much better than the 200cu in ChevII stick shift I had and
it was very good, but a smaller car.

Fuel went up here this week.
I wouldn't be surprised if it's up 50% over the next year. Demand is
driving prices. One good thing is the oil companies will have enough
cash to develop and deliver much more expensive oil sources, else we
would run out of oil.

 

True and what a price they pay. >

 

Yes, my wife's 2001 Sebring key is over $200.
Another reason to keep an oldie car, but I recently heard from a car
mechanic that thieves are now stealing the oldies that don't have such
fancy anti theft devices.

 

The spare key I bought for my 07 Sonata costs $2.95. No chips, no gimmicks.

 

Who the hell trusts Consumer Reports these days?

 

How many of those fancy key fobs come with the 2007 Town & Country Touring?

 

Tailpipe emissions and fuel consumption are two different things.

Sadly, with the state of the art today, we are saddled with the spectre of
increased fuel consuimption in order to "feed" those devices that help
cleanse the exhaust stream of our cars...

That 48 Chev was designed and built in a era that fed todays pollution
woes....

As for George - a remote keyless entry fob is $49CA at our store and
(providing anyone can read simple words) the instructions to program the fob
are printed in the owners manual.

Someone is going to chime in and say "but the air is fine where I live...".
And that may well be true. But, if the garbage truck didn't stop by once a
week, it would take long for your front yard to fill up with trash bags.
Since there is no garbage guy picking up exhaust emissions, it falls to the
car to make as few emissions as possible....

Myopia as a way of life.... interesting concept....

 

Yep... if I'm going to lose something, I'd much rather lose my car than one
of them overpriced keys....

Besides, there's no adventure if I go back to the parking lot knowing my car
will still be there.... kept safe by that overpriced key.

Some folks aren't happy unless they are bitching about something. "The key
costs too much..."..... "They stole my farkin' car...".

I wonder if folks would still prefer an unchipped car if it drove the price
of their insurance up?

 

George Orwell wrote:

Welcome to 1984