How's the PT-Cruiser??

So I suppose then that makes some of the Honda Accords, Toyota Corollas,
Mercedes M class, BMW's X & Z class, Mazda's et al American Cars.

Which would mean the Ford Windstar, Chevy Monte Carlo and others built in
Canada foreign cars.

Dang. I bet NASCAR will be pissed when they find out they let foreign cars
run in the races.

============

 

That's not as significant as its being the product of a German company.

 

Dang! Goldurn! *aHyuck!* NASCAR is stupid.

DS

 

It's really become a question of "domestic brand" vs. "import brand", IMO.
The important questions now are 'to where are the revenue dollars sent', and
'how are they spent'?

Car for car, more dollars stay in the USA when you buy a GM, Ford or
"Chrysler" vehicle as opposed to a Toyota, Kia, or BMW, regardless of point
of assembly. Mercedes is an interesting question (I don't know) and
"captive" makes (such as Volvo, Jaguar, etc.) are also questionable. And of
course, the unrestrained-free-trader set and the one-global-economy true
believers will tell you that none of this matters. (Got your ears on,
Chris? )

As long as the press still identifies it as the "American automobile
industry," I'm going to take it as axiomatic that my dollars best benefit my
local economy (Michigan) by purchasing the traditional domestic brands.
Since good employment is hard to come by, I've become a firm believer in not
whizzing in the pool in which I must swim. I recommend that everyone in the
USA/NAFTA region do the same, and it is my heartfelt wish that they would.

Worrying about whether the thing was built with parts from, or assembled in,
Mexico or China is a red herring designed to confuse the issue. Obviously, I
would prefer 100% domestic content in a domestically-branded vehicle, but
the current state of the stock market has f***ed us out of that possibility
being realistic.

--Geoff

 

Yes, yes, no. Ford and GM are headquartered in the US. Chrysler is a brand
of DaimlerChrysler AG, a German company.

Actually, we have been fucked out of that possibility by MBAs who consider
it beneath their station in life to know anything about the product or
service their company offers.

DS

 

Even Toyota makes lemons once in a while.

 

Prove it. What a bunch of crap. I don't even agree with many CR reviews
but this is slander.

 

You are mistaken. ABC was the one involved with Food Lion, not Consumer
Reports. You obviously don't know what you are talking about.

 

Actually Toyota is having auto transmission parts built and assembled into
fully AT's in the US. Not sure about engines. But arguably, a US built
Toyota creates more jobs in the US (meaning money stays here) then a
Canadian or Mexican built Chrysler.

 

You could argue that, I suppose. But you'd be wrong.

--Geoff

 

I'm hip to the meaning of the 'AG' behind DaimlerChrysler AG, and
eventually what you're saying will be 100% true. I don't think it's quite
there yet, though; there's still very significant staff, investment and
sourcing that happens here. If it weren't for the trucks and minivans, I
think we'd be talking about a purely all-German company by now. So are they
as German as Volkswagen, say? In terms of where the dollars flow, I don't
*think* so, at least not in 2004. But I'd be convinced if somebody could
show me (credibly) that the stock is more than 50% non-US owned.

But it's really academic, and maybe it's more of an emotional case --
Detroit has been very reluctant to give up the little brother of the "Big
Three" to foreign ownership, at least in the way we think about it. All the
local news media are still referring to that outfit with the big building
out there in Auburn Hills as 'Chrysler', not DaimlerChrysler, with the
exception of the folks giving the stock quotations.

My little nod to the merger is enclosing "Chrysler" in quotes, as you see
above. Believe me, it hurts to have to do it.

--Geoff

 

Evidnetly not. Toyota is going to run in NASCAR next year.

 

They ran trucks at Daytona and will continue this year. They are trying
to get into Nextel Cup by 2007, I heard. I assume they are thinking of
the Camry, or maybe they have another vehicle "in the pipe" that will be
built in the USofA.

Dan

 

Geoff wrote:

Car for car, more dollars stay in the USA when you buy a GM, Ford or

Where do you get this nonsense? The largest cost for a car that is
made in the U.S. is the high cost of labor - from the assembly to the
managers to the maintainence crew to the shipping and supply chain,
as well as the energy and materials used to run and build the factory.

All of that is also middle-class labor - a vital and shrinking segment
of the U.S. economy that we need to protect. All fo them with a
fat paycheck, btw - that gets spent in the local economy. $100
million goes in - $98 million+ gets spent by those employees.
(rest is savings based upon how we don't bother to do so)

Let's not forget taxes, either. Those U.S. employees also pay
a lot of taxes and fees. Take 50,000 of them away to Mexico or
China and suddenly that's a chunk out of the state's economy and
several towns or an entire county/township that's all but bankrupt.
(see Flint, Michigan for an example of this)

Also, environmental laws and quality of life is a fraction of what
it is in the U.S, once you cross over into Mexico. That water
supplies go for sometimes hundreds of miles isn't even considered.
Talk to the people of El Paso, Texas about how they feel about the
situation right across the border.

What matters most is where that plant is and secondly, if it's not
in the U.S. - that it's in a contry with equally high living standards
so that we aren't dumbing down the workforce in our country or our
allies'.

You'll note that while GM and Ford are building plants in China,
Mexico, and wherever they can for cheap, Toyota and Honda are
building them in the U.S. Evidently Toyota's not going bankrupt
last I checked, so there's no reason GM anf Ford can't make
their cars in the U.S. as well.

Our government should definately do something to stop this
middle-class and high-tech bleed-off of jobs overseas, even if
it means tarrifs and restrictions. The alternative is to turn
into Mexico in 40-50 years. Very rich and the very poor.

 

For me, they're ALL that kind of thread.... I've been around long enough
I thought everyone knew that ;-)

 

Nope, cars produced in Canada and Mexico are "domestic."

 

Yep, and it was absolutely hilarious reading about their T(u)RD
engineers trying to figure out how to build a cast-iron pushrod v8
engine last year, and then showing up about 50 horsepower short at
Daytona speedweeks. Count me in with Jimmy Spencer- I love watching
Toyota get whipped.

 

Right! I care a lot less about where a company is headquartered OR where
the (mostly automated) assembly lines are. I care most about where the
engineering happens, and for the Dodge, Jeep, and (to a lesser degree)
Chrysler components of DaimlerChrysler AG, that happens in Auburn Hills,
Michigan. For now... :-/

 

Kinda reminds me of a food chain. How 'bout you?

 

It would have to be RWD, which might mean a new RWD vehicle for
us here in the U.S. - maybe a RWD Avalon or simmilar.