Challenge every Red Light Camera Ticket!

The above is one of the reasons why the US is in *sixteenth* place on the
ranked list of countries by highway injuries, fatalities and property
damage per vehicle-mile travelled and per vehicle registered. Virtually
every country that's higher on the list makes extensive use of
roundabouts.

The problem is one of education -- ANY street or intersection is unsafe if
people misuse it.

DS

 

They also reduce fuel waste, noise and exhaust emissions.

 

Threeducks wrote:

No, I didn't say that at all. Most of the intersections along
Telegraph, Woodward, Gratiot, the Mile roads, etc., work just fine
without any modification. The intersection of Eight Mile and Woodward
is a good use of a bridge/ramp design, as is the one of I-75, the
service drive and Eight Mile. Most intersections carry much less
traffic than those two, and most are served perfectly well by standard
traffic signals.

--Geoff

 

Well, I'll agree that the state of driving skills in the U.S. is
atrocious. I'm just not sure that any amount of education can reverse
things; it's like the genie was let out of the bottle a long time ago
and now we're stuck with bad driving being the norm.

I also think there's a lot of poorly designed roadways out there.
Most of the exits along I-696 through suburban Detroit require that you
cut across multiple lanes of traffic after reaching the top of the ramp
in order to be able to make the right hand turn onto the north-south
thoroughfare you're trying to reach. The exit from I-75 southbound to
Outer Drive downriver has a local road which crosses it...in an opposing
direction! (Imagine getting *that* kind of surprise after dark!)

There's already enough bad implementations of the road designs with
which we're all familiar, why introduce a new one?

--Geoff

 

symptons of a larger problem.

 

Plenty of volume in NYC. Redesigning won't stop all red light runners, but it
will prevent most of them.

 

If an average driver can figure this out, why can't your local DOT figure
it out. On low volume roads they work ok. On a high volume road they just
slow down traffic.

 

If there is a lot of traffic in the circle, then you have to stop and
wait. You can't make room to merge where there is none.

 

Well, sure, Geoff, let's just outlaw progress and innovation, and ban the
importation of good ideas from other countries. Let's let Homer Simpson
win.

Pfft.

 

I grew up with roundabouts in the UK, many of them on major highways.
Their diameter was large, and it was possible to traverse them at
considerable speed most of the time. They did slow down somewhat in the
rush hours but on the whole were pretty good.

Of course there was a difference in the way people drove. There was no
"give way to the ...." rule (other than "Give way to traffic already on
the roundabout"): drivers approaching an intersection at about the same
time mostly followed the "After you, Claude." "No! No! After *you*,
Cecil" approach, and everything sorted itself out on the basis of common
sense and courtesy. All quite unlike the "Get out of my way, you @#%$&*,
before I run you off the road" approach common in many US cities.

Roundabouts of a decent size do take more space than regular
light-controlled intersections but are cheaper than over/underpasses.

MB

 

At their best, they eliminate having to stop and wait your turn at an
intersection, and they greatly reduce crash rates.

At their worst, you have to stop and wait your turn just like at a crossed
intersection, but they still greatly reduce crash rates.

 

He already has!!!

Dan

 

There's snow and ice in the winter here too, but in my experience that
doesn't affect the traffic circles more than any other intersection.
What does affect the traffic flow through them is the use of turn
signals and correct lane use. Fortunately "most" drivers around here
have figured out how to drive right, left, and straight in a traffic
circle, but not all and they can really **** things up.

One thing I really hate are people who turn left without signaling
(often these people hold a phone in one hand and steer with the other)
and the ones that try, and sometimes fail, to turn left using only the
right lane (mostly old people and women).

Especially when I'm driving a truck I get pissed a the former category
when they force me to brake hard at last moment and have to start from a
complete stop. Had they instead used their turn signal I would have
adjusted my speed in advance to avoid stopping.

Speaking of turn signals, traffic circles is one of few places turn
signal DRLs can actually confuse other drivers. Especially when turning
left and switching the turn signal from left right in the traffic circle
as you're about the exit. I've noticed that people about to enter tend
to wait to make sure I exit before they dare to enter when I'm driving
my Camaro while in the BMW they usually drive right when I activate the
right signal.

Ulf

 

And likely reduce crash *severity* as well, as compared to normal
90-degree crossing intersections. Crashes on a rotary are likely to be at
a small angle (sideswiping) rather than the T-bone type accidents that are
more likely at where two roads cross if someone runs a light or fails to
yield.

This, of course, assumes that someone doesn't do something really
boneheaded like drive around a rotary in the wrong direction.

-Andrew

 

I'm assumming that you're talking about north america.. here in
Northern New England, we've had roundabouts or circles for decades...
ten or so years ago, many of them were ripped out infavor of a
90degree intersection... I've only seen one built since that time.

-Bret

 

my only complaint about the major intersections in and around detroit
is that they could put the sign for the "michigan left"s a little
farther away from the intersection. when we go to visit the inlaws in
Warren, I'm forever getting caught on wrong side of the road for the
given intersection.

-Bret

 

I wonder about that. I agree with you with competent drivers, but with US
drivers I think the delays would be greater in the worst case. Rutinely I
find people having a hard time with things like right-on-red, merging,
and similar driving tasks. However the result seems to be the same,
stop/slow and wait. and wait. and wait. until a gap big enough for
them comes along. I fear roundabouts would not only have US drivers
queuing up to get in the roundabout, but drivers doing the big ben rutine
from national lampoon's european vacation movie.

 

What we need is a really large multilane roundabout to filter out the
LLBs. Those who choose to cruise in the left lane remain in the
roundaout till the realize the error of their ways

 

you mean like this one?

http://wjz.com/localstories/local_story_233065958.html

or this one?

http://www.fcw.com/geb/articles/2001/sep/geb-comm2-09-01.asp

or this?

http://www3.roanoke.com/columnists/gottstein/11342.html

I can go on all day... google is your friend

nate

 

Depends. Sometimes yes.

I've actually seen it happen on occasion.