American vs German Quality

The whole thread has degenerated into "my brand is perfect and all
others suck" Totally meaningless.

To put it somewhat back where I started. After looking at it (500) on
the lot (no intentions of buying, just curious) I check the net. A
few reviews were all I did but the consensus was that they will be
found in the rental fleets and that's about it. My current 2001
Taurus is my 4th sequential ford product (3 fords, 1 sable) and have
had no problems with any of them. Why ford? Only because of the
dealer. I'd be just as happy driving GM or Chrysler.

Harry K

 

Well, Harry - this IS a Chrysler newsgroup so why shouldn't we be supportive of
our brand, huh?????

 

Personally 3.

One guy is on his 5th CV, his last one had 400 000km and he only got rid of
it because it was written off in a crash. It burned a little oil but other
than that it was fine.

Another guy drives a cab. He used to drive a CV and got 450 000 km trouble
free. Last he saw his car (which another cab driver bought), it had another
200 000 km on it. His wife drives a Lincoln Towncar. She has 600 000km
trouble free. Many people he knows in the cab industry swears by CVs.

A third guy has had several CVs and found them quite reliable. He only got
rid of them because he wanted a new car.

Plus look at any reliability ratings. Not only the supposedly
biased-against-American CR, but any reports on the internet, etc. CV gets
high marks for reliability.

I don't know what fleet managers you were talking too, but everyone else has
had good luck with CVs.

 

That's more or less my thought. I'm not saying "my brand is perfect and all
others suck", but some seem to take it that way. I'm just saying "It isn't
that bad, and yours isn't particularly amazing in comparison.:

I drive a Ford and I drive a Chrysler. All cars that I've owned in the past
20 years have been Fords or Chryslers. The last bad car I had was an '80
Camaro. Even with that in mind I'd wouldn't have a problem buying Ford,
Chrysler or even GM as a next car (I'd buy GM depending on the model, Buicks
for example are pretty reliable)

 

UK's Number 1 seller by a long chalk. Has been at or near this position for
years. (Not same in Germany, however, where Numero Uno is the VW Golf.)

http://www.smmt.co.uk/dataservices/...=-2&info=privacy&CFID=585293&CFTOKEN=82740000

Clicking on any of the titles gives a spreadsheet and commentary (and a
press release), if you are interested in more details.

DAS
--
For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling
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[...]

[...]

 

--
For direct contact replace nospam with schmetterling[/QUOTE]

Clarkson is a narrow-minded, ignorant, bigoted, addlepated asswipe if
that's what he thinks. And I'm not even FROM Alabama.[/QUOTE]

FROM DAS: See my other reply (to KokomoKid). He is otherwise a vey
entertaining motor journalist, making very appealing TV programmes.

FROM DAS: 'Not invented here' syndrome? Unwillingness to admit that
somebody else may have developed something superior to the 'best car in the
world'?

The M-Class was aimed at the Range Rover.

 

No transmission truly needs umpteen different TEMPERATURE sensors to
work right. Its not the 5 speeds that make it a Rube Goldberg dream, its
the design.

 

Bill 2 wrote:

I've got an all-Chrysler fleet at the moment, but I'm not allergic to
Ford. OTOH, I'd be REALLY careful buying a GM. No Chevy-designed engines
(no 3100 or 3400 for sure, maybe a Gen-III v8 is now corporate enough to
have cured the ills of its SBC roots) but I'd gladly own a Buick 3800 or
a Northstar engine powered model. And despite the fact that I'm not a
big fan of the Ford Modular and think the Windsors were thoroughly
superior in most respects, I will admit that (much like the Chrysler
41TE transmission) Ford has slowly and painfully worked out the bugs
pretty well over the past 10 years. I still wish they'd design an
all-new V8 family ala Chrysler's 5.7/6.3 program, but I don't see it
happening for a while.

 

Because they're not on Usenet and it's not my job.

Because I don't care whether you believe me or not.

 

Everyone else? Are ya *sure* about that? Or are you only sure about the
three you know about? I really have no particularly compelling interest in
convincing you that many versions of the Ford Modular V8 are garbage. I'm
sure your reality is very real to you, and that's fine. I will say this
about the "everyone else" you believe has had "good luck" with Clown
Victorias:

Luck has nothing to do with it. Engineering quality is what determines
reliability.

 

Translation: You don't have anything to cite.

Then you'll pardon my disbelief.

Have a nice day.

Cheers,

 

Actual translation: You're not worth it!

 

No, I mean everyone else. Check any reliability records on the CV. It scores
quite high.

Kind of like how you have no compelling interest in convincing me that the
3.0L Vulcan engine is garbage? You still think that, don't you?

 

Ritz wrote:

Just because there isn't a handy citation somewhere in the magical world
of cyberspace doesn't mean that a statement is untrue. I have also
talked to some fleet maintainers who found that in the early years of
the Modular they need to keep a strangely large supply of important
parts on hand compared to the previous Ford engines and compared to GM
and Chrysler engines.

 

Right. I truly don't care what you think.

 

Daniel, why do you have to be such a prick? You make a statement and
people ask you what you base that statement on. Your reply is
basically, kiss my ass, I don't care what you think. So I'm inclined to
discount your opinion entirely.

If I want to know about lightbulbs, I'll gladly defer to your
experience, but I'm certainly not going to take anything you say about
the Ford Modular V8 or 3.0L V6 without some shred of independently
verifiable evidence. Your commentary simply doesn't jibe with my day to
day experience with either of those engines.

Granted, this isn't nearly as interesting as your diatribe on gay (or
perhaps not so gay) hollywood legends, but I see a pattern here of you
making assertions without any shred of credible evidence. If you don't
have any evidence, just say so. No need to be a jerk about it.

Cheers,

 

Well, that doesn't jibe with my first hand experience. Perhaps you can
convince your "fleet maintainer" to post some thoughts about their
experiences....

Cheers,

 

Well, I *could* post the e-mail from the Ford platform engineer I've been
conversing with for the last year or so -- he's been through three engines
in his Marauder, and is replacing it with an '05 Pontiac GTO before
there's a chance for a fourth -- but that would be slimy of me, since I
don't have his permission and don't feel like asking for it. I could also
tell you the name of the motor pool manager at UM, but here again, I
don't have his permission, don't feel like asking for it, and he doesn't
need you ringing his phone asking if I'm telling the truth.

Hey, here we go: I could send you to Ford TSBs for the last 6 years. You
don't need my permission to go look at 'em and read up on intake manifold
and cylinder head and oil consumption problems with modular V8s. All you
need is a little self-motivation.

Naw, not really...I truly don't care what you believe, so why would I
pardon it or reject it?

 

Ritz, if you don't like my posts, nobody forces you to read them.

Try reading harder next time. My response was to provide the basis for my
statement. Others then said they don't believe me, and I said "Fine".

Fine.

DS

 

So of course you conclude everyone's lying whose experience differs from
your own experience with a couple cars.