300M A/C pressures way too high (solution)

Eh?

What data does the dealership service department get that you cannot obtain
from
purchasing the factory service manual set, and/or alldata, along with the
appropriate
diagnostic tools?

Granted, a DRB scanner from Chrysler is about $5K new, but aftermarket ones
exist that do virtually everything that the factory one does.

Dealership service departments live off warranty work, done both with
factory
warranty and under extended warranty. And the new warranties appear to be
longer, so this is just going to have the effect of driving more people into
the
dealership service department first. (in hopes that the problem is covered
under
warranty)

Making it easier for the car to tell the owner what the problem is, isn't
going to
do anything to bugger up the current system. For crying out loud, the
majority
of people actually PAY someone labor to do oil changes! If the general
public
is so mechanically inept that they cannot even do that, then how is giving
the
owner a better idea of what is wrong going to decrease service work for the
dealership?

Consider this too. While I've never worked in a dealership service
department
I get the feeling that most dealership service department managers would
hire
all minimum-wage, entry-level, inexperienced parts-changers if they
thought they could get away with it. Certainly it seems like most
dealership service
departments have a large percentage of people like this and a small
percentage
of mechanics that really know their ass from a hole in the ground. If
anyone
is yelling to the automakers to make their cars easier to diagnose, it's the
dealerships,
simply so they can hire less-experienced, cheaper mechanics.

Ted

 

That sure sounds like an overcharged system to me. You might want to find
someone with the appropriate guage set and see what your low and high
pressures are like to be sure. As soon as I recharged my system to the
correct specs, the short cycling stopped and the compressor became noticibly
quieter.

Cheers,

C

 

That would be interesting to do, but unfortunately I don't have the
tools to do that job and I am sure the dealer won't touch it since it
does put out cold air. Therefore they will say "working as designed".
I complained about that noise during the new car's first summer. They
did claim to discharge and recharge the a/c when they performed a TSB
for that condition. The fix was to install a "flow straightener." It
didn't affect the noise a bit, and I later found out that the TSB was
for earlier builds of the car than mine.

I expressed my concern about the short cycling as well and even got the
local zone rep involved. Everyone thought I was making a big deal of
something that was operating completely normal. I am still concerned
that the short cycling will shorten compressor life but the warranty
won't fix it if it isn't broken.

On the other hand, I have heard that it is normal for LH cars to cycle
the a/c fairly often. Anybody have any experience?

How difficult is it to measure those pressures if one has the guage?

 

When I was service manager at a Toyota dealership, I had issues with
the DP about charging/overcharging. I REFUSED to take the shop flat
rate, and made a point of NOT invoicing for little things like
lubricating sticky door handles, replacing wiper blades, or replacing
bulbs.
A customer would come into the parts department and buy a bulb, wiper,
or whatever, and then go out to the lot to install it. After watching
for a few minutes, I'd grab the appropriate tool, go out, and install
the part for the customer. They'd invariably ask "how much" - and I'd
send them off with a wave, and "just remember us when you've got
something worth while".
Boss wanted a work-order.
Processing a workorder in 1986 cost $25.00, including cost of form,
filing, etc. from service desk to final .
Our retention rate (3 yr) was over 100%. (means we serviced more cars
than we sold) and absorption was routinely above 80% - and often over
100% (means the service department profits paid 80% or more of the
entire operating costs of the dealership) - and we didn't have to
overcharge or do un-necessary work to do it.
Couldn't afford to do un-necessary work, as the bays were always full.

Common problem was sticky door handles. Solution was a well-aimed shot
of "white lightning" carb and choke cleaner followed by some wiggling
and a drop of oil.
If I made a workorder and charged enough to break even, the customer
would have a $30 bill including taxes. Next time anything went wrong -
a flat tire, bad muffler, or whatever, all he'd remember was the
$30.00 bill to lube the doorhandle, and Firestone, speedy, Midas, or
whoever got the business. Lube-It got the oil change, and you never
saw the guy again - he'd be driving a Nissan or a Chevette next time.

As it was, they remembered the good service - and it didn't matter
WHAT the problem was, the first place they thought to take the car was
back to the dealer. They told their friends too - including those who
bought their car across town or in the city down the highway.
And we sold them their next Toyota.

The service department made the DP several million dollars over 10
years. Not counting the repeat sales.

When the "philosophical differences" between myself and the DP got to
be more than I wanted to put up with, and I left, they switched to
flat rate, and charging for EVERYTHING, overnight.
Lost a LOT of customers. Lost profitability, and reputation.

"When the bottom line is the bottom line, you can't get past the
bottom line"

 

Flat rate IS the problem. Makes mechanics try to cheat the system.
Many Flat Rate mechanics make more money with their pen than with
their tools. Piles of parts end up under the mechanic's toolbox,
instead of in the customer's car. Jobs where overlap exists are
charged separately.
Diagnostics are NOT covered by flat rate. They are billed extra. The
good mechanic is penalized, as he only gets .5 units for finding the
problem, while the imbecile gets paid for 5 units. Said imbecile also
gets paid for replacing 10 parts that have nothing to do with the
problem.
So the GOOD mechanic says "screw it", packs up his tools and goes
driving truck, or whatever, where he doesn't have to deal with all the
crap.

(Left the trade over 15 years ago)

Now, try to hire a good mechanic - or try to find one.
They are not working at the dealerships - and in many cases not in the
trade anymore.

 

With OBDII you are just about there - but it would help if the manuals
gave you the information to interpret the information the scanner
gives you. Mst of the "flow charts" are bunged up, and don't lead you
to the problem.

 

I'm the one that made the post about the Ethernet jack on the car, and what
your
talking about IS the problem - the need for manuals. With todays
microelectronics
it's totally unnecessary. The entire manual and diagnostics info can be
retained on
storage in the car computer. All that should be necessary is to plug in a
laptop
and obtain an IP number from a DHCP server on the car, then fire up your web
browser and type in http://diagnostics.chrysler.com or some such and bang -
you
have the complete car computer right there, plus all service manuals and
diagnostic
testing procedures. You can even drive the car around and get updates of
what
the engine is doing in real time, right on the screen.

Say what you want about Chrysler making money off the tech manuals but I
don't
think that is true at all. I've seen the prices on techauthority and they
are barely
breaking even on sending all that paper out the door. The CDROM
subscriptions are
more profitable of course, but that isn't going to go away because you can't
put the
TSB info for future TSB's into the car at point of manufacture, so there
will still be
need of subscriptions. It's just that you can completely do away with DRB
scanners and
the like.

Ted