300C vs Monaro vs Jag S

Last night on a BBC channel Top Gear, probably the UK's premier TV motoring
programme, ran a head-to-head test of three "muscle cars":
- Vauxhall Monaro (i.e. the Holden from Australia)
- 300C (which is coming to the UK with RHD next year)
- souped-up Jaguar S with 4-litre engine.

The panel of three -- including the known-in-the-USA Jeremy Clarkson --
voted 2:1 for the Monaro, the minority vote going for the Jag.

All three did not like the 300C's ride/handling or interior, but did like
its imposing appearance ("designed by Al Capone") and its relatively low
price.

DAS

 

Is the Monaro the same as the Pontiac GTO? The GTO is a relabled Holden.

 

Correct, the Holden/Vauxhall is the Pontiac GTO, though I don't know how
many changes are made in the tramsition, other than the location of the
steering wheel. Probably only few.

All General Motors, innit?

DAS

 

The styling of the GTO doesn't strike anything in me. Haven't seen very
many on the road but perhaps the styling will grow on me. As for the 300C I
wonder what it was about the ride that the reviewers didn't like. I like
the ride of mine and with 9,000 miles on the odometer there are no squeeks
or anthing of the sort in the interior. This is one solid well-built car.

 

You'll be happy to know that according to a news report I just heard it took
top honors for safety in new tests.

 

| | > Correct, the Holden/Vauxhall is the Pontiac GTO, though I don't know how
| > many changes are made in the tramsition, other than the location of the
| > steering wheel. Probably only few.
| >
| > All General Motors, innit?
| >
| > DAS
|
| The styling of the GTO doesn't strike anything in me. Haven't seen very
| many on the road but perhaps the styling will grow on me. As for the 300C I
| wonder what it was about the ride that the reviewers didn't like. I like
| the ride of mine and with 9,000 miles on the odometer there are no squeeks
| or anthing of the sort in the interior. This is one solid well-built car.
|
|

The Pontiac GTO, the last I checked, is selling worse than their Pontiac Aztec
model.

 

Perhaps the fact that the reviewers are British, reviewing two vehicles built
for British roads, and the 300C is built for American roads, which I would
assume (having never been to Britain) are quite different????? As for the GTO -
it isn't, it can't, and it never will be a GTO (there is more to a GTO than
just pasting three letters on a car).
RP

 

Which is a crying shame, because it's the closest thing to a Real
Car(tm) that Generic Motors has offered in the US for quite a while,
with the possible exception of the C6.

nate

 

General Motors - Drifting Lackadaisically In The Vague Direction Of
Improvement, We Gradually Catch On. Our Products Could Be Better, But Hey,
They're Better Than Before.

The only problem with this highly representative corporate slogan is that
it's REAL damn tough to fit on a seatbelt pushbutton unless you use a
*super* tiny font. So they stick with "GM - Mark of Excrement" or
something similar.

 

Wallows, rides like a "boat". Also inability to turn off electric aids for
testing performance limits (which, I think, won't bother most 'ordinary'
drivers).

I was looking for a writeup on the website
http://www.topgear.com/content/misc/TV/
but I expect it's too recent. Maybe they don't give detailed TV programme
notes, concentrating on the printed magazine.

Clicking on a 300C review failed to bring up a useful page.

But there are some nice pics:
http://www.topgear.com/content/fun_stuff/gallery/F6/XX/gallery/


DAS[/QUOTE]

[...]
As for the 300C I

 

It sure doesn't "ride like a boat".

 

While the GTO is a decent car, it has some things going against it.
First of all, it is rather pricey. Also, it looks too much like a
Cavalier on steroids for its intended market, which is more into the
"boy racer" treatment with fake hood scoops, etc. Also, the GTO has a
tiny trunk for such a big car.

The Aztek is horribly ugly, at least to most people, but with the big
rebates and not-too-high sticker, it is a good buy for how roomy it is.
I have two friends who own Azteks. Both are kind of embarrassed to be
seen driving them, but they bought them because they were a good value.

 

It'd be helpful to know whether they tested the NAFTA or the BUX ECE model
of the car. The suspension and braking tests required for ECE type
approval (which, in turn, is required of all new cars sold in the EU) are
absent in North American safety standards, and NAFTA models are (still!)
tuned for more of the proverbial "Boulevard ride" compared to export
models.

 

Are you sure you want me to respond to your comment? I think it was you who
was rather generally scathing about my posts.

DAS

 

Makes no nevermind to me whether you choose to do so or not.

Don't take it personally; I treat all stupid posts the same way regardless
of who's responsible for them.

 

Yep, GM completely blew it on the GTO. Its barely distinguishable from a
Grand Prix. Great mechanically and performance-wise, but the GTO name
needs style to go with it or its nothing.

 

It probably does "ride like a boat" compared to the Monaro and Jaguar.
The last time I was in the UK (it's been a few years, but I doubt much
has changed) the roads in the countryside were very well maintained and
smooth, but often twisty, and fun. On the other hand, many parts of the
U.S. have pot holes, rough expansion joints, etc. but go mostly in
straight lines. Therefore, the 300 suspension may be "better tuned" for
North American roads, but compared to most European cars, it probably
"rides like a boat." The solution, of course, is to build 300's with
somewhat stiffer suspension for the European market. To my knowledge,
there are no plans to build right hand drive 300's, so they sell only a
handful in the UK, no matter how well the suspension works. Someone
please post if I am wrong and they ARE building right hand drive 300's.

 

For all it's faults, terrible visability and general uglyness, the 300
does not ride like a boat. Quite the contrary it has extrodinary handling.
The 300C is a Mercedes E Class with a huge Chrysler engine and heavier
components. When I test drove the 300 and the 300C they stuck to the road
like glue. I test drove a BMW and the Acura TL on the same day and neither
could compare, the 300C was in a completely different class. I only wish
that Chrysler would offer a more attractive body style with properly sized
windows and call it an Imperial or New Yorker or something. I'd love to
have a car that drove like a 300 but also had a rear window that was large
enough that you could parallel park it. BTW I previously compared the
300's visabilty to a submarine, that's unfair to the new Virginia class
attack subs that have just been launched. The Virginia class subs have
done away with the periscope and replaced it with digital displays. If
Chrysler would add a good digital display (I think Lexus has one in an
SUV) they could fix their design mistake the the tiny windows.

 

They do... its called 'Magnum.'

The more Magnums I see, the better they look. The low rakish look WORKS
with the Wagon body lines much better than with the notch-backed profile
and big-mouth grille on the 300.

 

I do like the Magnum better than the 300, but it's a station wagon. If
there was a sedan version of the Magnum I'd be interested.